Antifreeze not allowed?

M

Mike_Stimson

Wrench
I just noticed the change in the IRDC sups for Pacific and The Ridge that now bans antifreeze, and I wanted to see if this is where Conference is headed.

LeMons and ChumpCar both ban antifreeze, but they theoretically race $500 junkers driven by potentially less experienced drivers prone to carnage. We raced both series extensively, and removing the antifreeze before a race is a pain. The color does not want to leave the system, so it is tough to tell if you got all the antifreeze out, and makes tech difficult. Worse, if we do not get antifreeze and its corrosion inhibitors back into the system shortly after the race, we see significant corrosion in the aluminum and iron in our engine.

I would like to think Conference drivers are less likely to have contact and also have better maintained cars than a $500 race series. I understand antifreeze is slippery, but so is gear lube, transmission oil, engine oil and worn out pavement.

Are the other member clubs also planning to ban antifreeze, or is this just an IRDC condition?

Mike
 
Mike, the stipulation prohibiting glycol based coolant additives is in the contracts from the facilities, it's not something IRDC came up with as a club, we're just trying to follow the rules.

FWIW, I have run straight water with success, it actually has superior heat transfer vs. a mix. The key is to integrate a sacrificial anode into the cooling system. I welded a pipe thread bung into the overflow tank and installed an anode, and haven't had a problem with corrosion. Could easily be done in a hose tube as well.
 
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It's interesting to note that the ICSCC regulations specify water in most all discriptions of hoses, radiators and such. It mentions "coolant" only once and "glycol" not at all.

Water has been the traditional coolant of choice for not only it's efficiency, but lack of a super slick quality it gives to any racing surface that it may be thrown upon. Many of us 'assume' that the coolants used in the race cars are water, even though the comm report is normally emulated as "coolant". It usually disapates quickly unless it has other properties in it.

Do you suppose that it may be time for the ICSCC Regulations to become more specific in this area? Something like, "Engine coolant systems shall contain water only."

Ummm. Lemme see, I wonder what section that would go in...
 
To clarify Scott's comment, there was a proposal by IRDC, sparked (I believe) by the restrictions put in place by their tracks, to ban glycol-based coolants Conference-wide because of the issues associated with coolant getting dumped on any track. After a fair bit of discussion, the E-Board voted it down, but with the understanding that clubs could ban it as needed in the supp's.

In other words, while it certainly COULD be banned Conference-wide, it isn't yet, and it didn't sound like the E-Board was necessarily inclined to head in that direction without additional factors coming into play.
 
I always believed it was accepted as the racing norm, that no antifreeze of any type was used in road racing period. Distilled water with a bottle of Water Wetter works just fine. We've all seen the problems of cars dumping oil, but you have to have oil and other lubricants. A race car can be driven without the use of a slippery radiator coolant. Not sure why anyone would have a problem with banning traditional anti freeze.
 
Randy,

Thanks for the info on the sacrificial anode. I will look into that.

I do agree water has better heat transfer properties than glycol. I personally use glycol because it has a higher boiling point so it can protect from boil over under extreme conditions. It also keeps me from worrying if I got all the water out of the engine and cooling system over the winter so it does not freeze up. My worst complaint is when you have a cold weather event like the 25 hour, or a December Chump/LeMons event in CA when you have to cross the pass in foul weather. It can get extremely cold, so we transport the car with glycol to keep it from freezing if there is an issue on the pass, and then we drain and change at the track. It is a real pain, but I digress and it does not relate to most Conference events (other than the rare snow enduros).

Back to topic. I see this applies to both the Ridge and Pacific, so I thought it was an IRDC choice. It just surprised me to see it so emphasized in the sups. Does Pacific and The Ridge also require this for the safety vehicles, pace cars, schools and HPDE events. I am not trying to be a problem child but we do come to those events with our street cars, and it seems like most people bringing street cars would not change out coolant for the day.

Thanks again

Mike
 
Mike_Stimson said:
Randy,

Does Pacific and The Ridge also require this for the safety vehicles, pace cars, schools and HPDE events. I am not trying to be a problem child but we do come to those events with our street cars, and it seems like most people bringing street cars would not change out coolant for the day.

Thanks again

Mike
Click to expand...

This is one of the reasons that was discussed in E-board. I definitely do not believe conference would want to write this into rules that might apply to driver
training. I also completely agree with you about transporting with anti-freeze and then having to change it out. Big pain, and no clear disposal facilities for
2-3 gallons of antifreeze/water mix once you get to your destination. I am very glad conference didn't write this into their rules.
 
We also don't expect safety vehicles, pace cars, and those involved in HPDE to have contact which is often a cause of radiator spillage.

Come on guys, Pacific's and the Ridge's contracts specify no glycol. Arguing with the clubs that have to live with that won't do you a bit of good.
 
Just to be clear, my name's not on the entry list but we're not being poor sports about this topic... The main reason we can't attend the Seattle race is that our kids have a required dog show that weekend.
And my diff is toast ...
 
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Funny, I always thought antifreeze was banned, period...
Water Wetter, Kool- It and most of the other additives
have anti- corrosion packages that seem to work pretty
well- I've used them for years now and the cooling systems
of the race cars look better than my street cars...

"dog show???" Is that like the dog that ate my homework? ;)

t
 
"1109 D. Radiators and hoses. All oil and water radiators and hoses must be free from leakage and must be securely fastened"

But what if it's a glycol radiator? <snicker>

Don't be that guy! You know. That guy?

That guy that spews the... DIP!! And is the first one to slip in their own juices, creating havoc, chaos, and ultimately sucking away all the green flag track time from your fellow competitors. Only because that bottom hose that you figured had plenty of races left decided for itself that it had seen it's last heat cycle. POOF!

At least it wasn't a head gasket.

Don't be that guy, that everyone 'looks' at when they're being flat-towed through the paddock. Probably still dripping the dip.

Wouldn't you rather be that guy that puts an anode in a bung?
 
Disclaimer: The below story is not directed at anyone. It is strictly for entertainment purposes.

While we are not an oval track (yes, you read correctly) most ovals I competed at disallowed everything but water in the cooling system. Of course there were those who felt they'd never have a spill so who would know. Sure enough, they'd have a spill to which the track had a consequence. You spill it, you clean it . . . . alone. Most drivers would last about thirty to forty feet before the crew had to jump in and help. Until they did the announcer and a bit of fun with the fans at how quickly they were overcome with fatigue. Having Speedy Dry attach to ones sweaty skin and clothing on a hot summer evening assured one to never do that again. Fellow racers didn't take too kindly to it as well because of the shortened schedule. Worse yet was showing up at the next race with odd looking discolored stains on ones driving suit due to anti-freeze coming in contact with their clothing. A most memorable one was perfectly placed hand prints on the fanny portion of one's anatomy.
 
Karen Stimson said:
Just to be clear, my name's not on the entry list but we're not being poor sports about this topic... The main reason we can't attend the Seattle race is that our kids have a required dog show that weekend.
And my diff is toast ...
Click to expand...

I don't think anybody who knows you would think of you as a poor sport Karen. :)
 
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