12 hour enduro

I love the enduros and was a regular at the 6 hour, but can't handle the steep entry fee . You used to be able to recover your entry and a little bit of your costs if you won your class.
 
A number of the PRO3 cars are so well developed now that I don't think they want to beat on them for 12 hours. Attendance seems to have declinded consistently as the event went from 6 to 8 to 12 hours. At 6 hours you could use up old tires, so to speak, if you wanted to run the event on a budget. A twelve hour event is much more for the serious competitor.
 
I would agree with Lance about the 12 hour format affecting entries. That is quite a committment of funds to run that long, and I have heard other drivers recently talking about the 'good old day' of 8 hours.
 
Not to be a naysayer, but the survey respondents overwhelmingly voted for 12 hours vs. the other options. Maybe the sampling pool wasn't representative.

I think the real issue is back to back to back race weekends, and then only two weeks between that and the enduro.

The powers that be need to give more consideration to race scheduling at the fall meeting, to look at the viability of Conference as a whole, rather than just their own member club needs.
 
If the goal is to have 15-20 cars, then the survey is/was very representative. If the goal is to have 40-50 cars, then the survey did not reach all of those non participants. Seems like a lot of hard work by a lot of dedicated volunteers to then see a small grid. If the race went back to 6 hours, I'm sure every current entry would still enter. Then of course those that used to run it as a 6 hour would start to come back. But I've not seen much to describe what the goal of the event is these days. Quantity vs. Quality? Bring in Cali. entries to be a warm up to the 25-hour T-Hill race? When you see guys building specific enduro cars to run the race, then that begins to tell you what they think the chance of a sprint car has to go 12 hours. And your typical ICSCC race car is a 30 minute sprint car.
 
As Randy said, scheduling probably had a large impact on the year-end racing. Back-to-back races can be brutal; 3 races in 3 consecutive weekends (that's 2 weeks folks) is over the top. A number of us did it; a few people with major repairs in the middle. When setting the schedule, the powers that be need to remember that real life does happen between races--we need time to take a breath (clean laundry? what clean laundry? I was doing good to get my driving gear washed before heading out to help my mom).

Another factor for the enduro--we had 14 races this season, and alot of people are struggling with jobs and budgets. A high-cost enduro at the end of all that is going to take a hit.
Not to mention, we just got my car sorted out, I'm not going to flog it for 12 hours...

That all sounds negative, but it's not meant to--just meant to be factual. In fact, I'm having adrenaline withdrawl...
But I don't think we should ever see the 3 races in 3 weekends again. It's not realistic.
 
Good discussion.

But we did have a 6 hour option, and that saw a single entry last year. We also have a 6 hour enduro, and the numbers were off for that too. So I'm not sure the premise is accurate.

I think it's other factors, including the decision to combine all limited classes. The original intent of the limited classes was to provide an opportunity for people to bring out their sprint cars, with little additional preparation and expense, and to be competitive against other similarly minimally prepared cars.

It was theoretically the best of both worlds; a race where those of us that want to build dedicated cars and programs with an eye towards even bigger events could do that, and those of us that wanted to run what we already have with little or no changes, could also do that.

Lumping all limited class displacements together goes a long way in my opinion towards removing at least half the incentive because people will naturally feel like their chances of a class win are reduced. I'm not sure why that decision was made. If some classes needed to be combined for whatever reason, then combine all of the enduro classes into one unlimited class.

That's a better model in my opinion, for what it's worth, which isn't much.

Not that it matters all that much, because I really don't think that's the crux of the issue. It's really down to time and money. Too many races overall, too many concentrated at the end of the season, and an enduro a mere two weeks later.

Plus people that are holding their assets more closely in these uncertain economic times waiting to see what the federal tax rates are going to be, what the housing market is going to do, and on and on...
 
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Once upon a time, we had the CSCC 6hr, and then the SCCBC 7 hr, back to back. And those, only about two weeks after the final ICSCC championship points race event.

I don't know what changed, but those events were still owned by the clubs that presented them. Now those events seem to be considered as "Conference" due only to the fact that the insurance is purchased through those facilities. Each club's Race Chairman was considered the Chief Steward, and each club took on, and controlled their own event. I'm not sure that anything more than 'perspective' has actually changed. But it's all different now, isn't it?

CSCC listened to the drivers' survey that wanted 12 hrs. They went 12 hrs, and the first event was great. Then every year thereafter started dwindling in entry numbers. Last year the entries were just about mid-20's. The survey was taken seriously, but that survey is just so 'last year' now.

If the general 'entry' population were okay with a 6, or 8hr format, then they certainly might have spoken up before now. The CSCC BoD meets every month, and they have little else to deal with. But for now, the die is cast.

Next year, Perhaps the "Enduro(s)" can be presented to the ICSCC BoD as part of the normal schedule process.

Perhaps it is time for the events to rotate between clubs. Sure, CSCC can't be keep it forever, it doesn't really belong to them any more does it? That way CSCC wouldn't be on the hook every year. NWMS could put one on, or TC, or SCCBC again. Maybe CSCC, and IRDC could swap out every year with another club to 'share the wealth', and not leave them without opportunities. Put the Thanksgiving weekend on the schedule, or something even crazier.

Fuel towers anyone?
 
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Karen's comment about the 14 race schedule is exactly why a number of us met this summer to discuss the option of double race week-ends. In this economy the clubs will find the same dwindling entries for next season as we are seeing for the upcoming enduro. As for these enduros Randy seems to have a handle on that issue and will I'm sure continue to work thru that with CSCC and IRDC.
The clubs will all soon have to accept the fact that we can't run as many race week-ends as we have the last few years. Changes are necessary and a serious discussion is past due about this issue. I met with a lot of approval regarding this double format, but as usual considerable doubt and negativity from a few, including a few older racers/officials who really need to start thinking outside the proverbial box.
We didn't submit a proposal for this November because we just weren't ready, so we now have 12 months to discuss and sort it out.
For next year the clubs need to 1) cut back on the number of events, and 2) curtail the back-to-back stuff as much as possible. If there is no scheduling conflict at ORP, and I can't imagine why there would be, then why do a back-to-back with Mission? That must have been brutal, as were the last 3 events everyone struggled through. I have served on the E-board and I understand how difficult it can be to set the schedule based on the desires and committments of track owners, but something has to give here before we start losing both entries and workers.
 
E1 looks to be the strongest it has in several years with a handful of cars that should be pretty even on pace. I'm looking forward to it!

The E3 and E2 (formerly P3 & P2) classes seems to have taken big hits in the number of entries. These had been the most popular classes. Besides the poor economy and packed season schedule, why have these entries fallen off the most?

For me personally, the longer race is cheaper, as the cost can be shared by more drivers.
 
Just to chime in here, I'm with Randy and Karen on this. I'm just plain tired after the big push the last month of Conference racing.

I had actually planned on running the 12 hour, and some issues came up with the car. We tried putting another team together, and it didn't pan out. After that, to be honest, I was actually kinda' glad to be able to spend a weekend at home.

Usually, the timing for the spring, fall, and T-Hill come after a layoff, and I'm just jonsin' for a race, especially an enduro. Not so much, with this fall's schedule.

FWIW.

Dan
 
Not to divert the discussion, but this season we had 14 races + Enduros. What happens when the new track comes online in a year or three? Will there be another club wanting to host ICSCC races out there? Will IRDC continue to hold races at Pacific? Will we be up to a 16 or 17 race season? Will the local community add to the worker base without being paid? Will all the clubs have to start paying workers just to have enough to put on the events? There is such a thing as "too much of a good thing". The double race in two days is one way to reduce the number of weekends. How about doing away with practice? Simply qualify in the morning and race in the afternoon. There are test days on Friday before many, if not most of the events. Test days don't require as many workers. Food for thought as we go forward.
 
"16 to 17 races..." That Hermiston track is supposed to be making some rumbling noises again too.

That many races might create the need to regionalize championship point structures, and then honor points from other regions into an overall divisionalized championship season. That way each region can provide enough events to keep their existing dates (remaining solvent in their own right), and drivers would have a more diverse structure to work towards their seasonal goals (some may only run closer to home). Thinking about the differences between area, and senior drivers local points battles might look like...

Holy SCCA, Grandpa!
 
Don't forget that the ChumpCar endurance race at PIR is two weeks (Halloween) after the CSCC Enduro. I wonder how many racers decided to race with ChumpCar instead of CSCC?

(Full disclosure: I'll be racing on a ChumpCar team at PIR)
 
It's all a matter of who you can afford to race with, and who you want to race with... or both. It's really two different motorsport events. I know that there's a whole 'non-desanctionable worker' team, as there was last year at the Chumpcar's first All Hallowed's Eve.

Money goes where the most fun flows... I suppose.

badassstewie.jpg
 
Well I am coming all the way from Calgary Alberta for the race and I am thankful there are options to race into October and November....Up here racing ends in September. Plus Enduros are always the most fun I have racing.

Anthony K
 
Don't forget that the ChumpCar endurance race at PIR is two weeks (Halloween) after the CSCC Enduro. I wonder how many racers decided to race with ChumpCar instead of CSCC? ...

Sad situation if that is the case...^^


Now the entries for the Cascade 12H show at 16 per MotorsportReg.com

I'm still coming from Charlotte...but man do I wish more of my fellow competitors would be joining in the fun...
 
Well, this'll be the first enduro I'm missing in its entirety (as either driver or crew) in about 7 years. :(
 
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