A
albatross
Guest
Would any of you front running Club Ford guru(s) care to share the latest gearing set up in your Hewland MK 8/9 for Mission? Thanks in advance.
A
albatross
Guest
Mission Gearing, Portland , Too.
Amazing ! Simply amazing. Apparently nobody knows or nobody is willing to share their magic gear set up for Club Ford at Mission. Do Conference CF or FF race there or is it to scary? Also, what gearing do the CF use at Portland with the chicane? Might anybody share that? Thanks in advance.
Amazing ! Simply amazing. Apparently nobody knows or nobody is willing to share their magic gear set up for Club Ford at Mission. Do Conference CF or FF race there or is it to scary? Also, what gearing do the CF use at Portland with the chicane? Might anybody share that? Thanks in advance.
rick_lovett
Member
Portland with chicane:
18/33
20/30
23/28
25/26
18/33
20/30
23/28
25/26
A
albatross
Guest
Mission/Portland gears
Wes and Rick:
Thanks very much. I was surprised that nobody came back with a response after waiting over a week. So, I thought that I might challenge someone. Guess I became a little impatient - like most race car drivers. The settings you recommend for Portland are the same as for Seattle and that sounds a little tall, especially top gear. But, thanks anyway.
Wes and Rick:
Thanks very much. I was surprised that nobody came back with a response after waiting over a week. So, I thought that I might challenge someone. Guess I became a little impatient - like most race car drivers. The settings you recommend for Portland are the same as for Seattle and that sounds a little tall, especially top gear. But, thanks anyway.
Richard Broadhead
Flag & Com
One can always 'assume' based upon speaking FF language. But, assumptions can lead to wrong conclusions.
Would Wes and Rick be correct in assuming albatross is running a 9:31 R&P??
A handy chart for FF's when exchanging gears to adjust for different R&P's
http://www.taylor-race.com/pdf/GearConversion2.pdf
NOTE:
Do NOT attempt this maneuver simply to adjust between FF's, FC's or any other Hewland cars. It only applys to like cars with different R&P's
For those who have nothing better to do on Saturday night then wonder what happens "if" you change that 2nd gear, here's about the best gear selection XLS program I've found. Change stuff in blue and watch what happens. DL and unpack the ZIP file below image. Step 1 of course is gear inventory then a list of what's available from Hewland. Avoid prolonged use. It can cause confusion and in severe cases, brain damage.
Portland effect with a 9:31...
Would Wes and Rick be correct in assuming albatross is running a 9:31 R&P??
A handy chart for FF's when exchanging gears to adjust for different R&P's
http://www.taylor-race.com/pdf/GearConversion2.pdf
NOTE:
Do NOT attempt this maneuver simply to adjust between FF's, FC's or any other Hewland cars. It only applys to like cars with different R&P's
For those who have nothing better to do on Saturday night then wonder what happens "if" you change that 2nd gear, here's about the best gear selection XLS program I've found. Change stuff in blue and watch what happens. DL and unpack the ZIP file below image. Step 1 of course is gear inventory then a list of what's available from Hewland. Avoid prolonged use. It can cause confusion and in severe cases, brain damage.
Portland effect with a 9:31...
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trout_roberts
Well-known member
Albatross
You need to take into consideration that the car Rick works on is one of the fastest/quickest in Conference. For us mere mortals that set of gears may be a touch on the tall side.
You need to take into consideration that the car Rick works on is one of the fastest/quickest in Conference. For us mere mortals that set of gears may be a touch on the tall side.
rick_lovett
Member
Richard -
You're correct in that a gear change program is very helpful. I've used one for years.
Bob & Trout -
Thanks for the confirmation and kind words.
Now, if I can figure out how to keep Neil's motor together (Definately NOT Jay's fault!) we might be able to come out an play.
You're correct in that a gear change program is very helpful. I've used one for years.
Bob & Trout -
Thanks for the confirmation and kind words.
Now, if I can figure out how to keep Neil's motor together (Definately NOT Jay's fault!) we might be able to come out an play.
A
albatross
Guest
Gears for Mission and Portland
Well guys thanks very much for the suggested gear set-ups for each track. I expected the CF types to be using a 9:31 R&P which is all to common. Thanks for the reminder that some may not be and thanks so much for the cross referance chart which I'll be saving in my file. Apparently Mission is not so popular. I'm considering it for the Wetwood reunion. Those of us who raced at Westwood have much to remember, some good and some not so good, but truly a great track and mighty fine people. So, that's why I'm interested in the Wetwood 50 at Mission. Thanks to all for your suggestions.
Well guys thanks very much for the suggested gear set-ups for each track. I expected the CF types to be using a 9:31 R&P which is all to common. Thanks for the reminder that some may not be and thanks so much for the cross referance chart which I'll be saving in my file. Apparently Mission is not so popular. I'm considering it for the Wetwood reunion. Those of us who raced at Westwood have much to remember, some good and some not so good, but truly a great track and mighty fine people. So, that's why I'm interested in the Wetwood 50 at Mission. Thanks to all for your suggestions.
Richard Broadhead
Flag & Com
Indeed, it's to be expected in FF. But on occasion you do see an FF with the 10:31.
Just as, the 'norm' for FC's is 10:31 but you do occasion see one with the 9:31.
Why shucks, I even saw one guy asking for FC gears for a 13:36 once.
I think some of these oddities occur based upon what's available on the used market. Considering the cost of a R&P people take what they find (cheap) when they need it.
trout_roberts
Well-known member
I think that 13:36 is a stock VW ratio (2.76??). Pretty damn tall! Maybe from something with an automatic trans. That would have been tough to find suitable gear ratios for.
Richard Broadhead
Flag & Com
Agree, Trout.
But using a 14, 15 or 16 something ratios as a 1st gear it can be used and spaced properly with the 13:36.
If you have an endless supply of $228 dollars-ize for (genuine Hewland) gears it can happen
Don't think I've ever seen a 14 or 15 ratio for sale on the used market. But you do see 16's on occasion.
I noticed FF's are using a 16:35 at Mission. If you wanted to do that you'd have to run a 14:38 1st with a 13:36 R&P.
I did notice Rick Lovitt said an 18:33 1st for Portland (chicane) with a 9:31 That works out to an overall ratio of 6.31
We had an 18:33 in our Reynard last year at Portland with the 10:31. Listening to Jeff in the Festival I could tell he needed a lower 1st but we didn't have one
Bought a 17:34 and with the 10:31 that works out to an overall ratio of 6.21. Hope that works better for him this year.
Like I said, easy to suffer brain damage using that gear ratio analyzer!
But using a 14, 15 or 16 something ratios as a 1st gear it can be used and spaced properly with the 13:36.
If you have an endless supply of $228 dollars-ize for (genuine Hewland) gears it can happen
Don't think I've ever seen a 14 or 15 ratio for sale on the used market. But you do see 16's on occasion.
I noticed FF's are using a 16:35 at Mission. If you wanted to do that you'd have to run a 14:38 1st with a 13:36 R&P.
I did notice Rick Lovitt said an 18:33 1st for Portland (chicane) with a 9:31 That works out to an overall ratio of 6.31
We had an 18:33 in our Reynard last year at Portland with the 10:31. Listening to Jeff in the Festival I could tell he needed a lower 1st but we didn't have one
Bought a 17:34 and with the 10:31 that works out to an overall ratio of 6.21. Hope that works better for him this year.
Like I said, easy to suffer brain damage using that gear ratio analyzer!
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A
albatross
Guest
Hewland v-a-v Webster gears
Are there any advantages in purchasing Hewland gears (which are more expensive than) over Webster gears? Better metal ? Better machining? Last longer? Availability? Less drag? And, how 'bout gear oils? Any preferance and why? Thanks again.
Are there any advantages in purchasing Hewland gears (which are more expensive than) over Webster gears? Better metal ? Better machining? Last longer? Availability? Less drag? And, how 'bout gear oils? Any preferance and why? Thanks again.
Richard Broadhead
Flag & Com
Albastross,
The whole Webster/Hewland debate is an on going thing. However, Craig Taylor says the newest generation from both manufacturers are equal.
Price for Websters $195
Price for Hewlands $228
I have yet to hear the definative arguement that confirms one is superior over the other metalurgically (often part of the debate) or in machining (often part of the debate).
How do I choose which to buy? I guess it depends upon my mood on the particular day I order. Sometimes Websters from Pegasus sometimes Hewlands from Averill Racing Stuff. The car purchase Jeff made included a mix and I guess we're keeping that tradition going. Word is, mixing Websters and Hewlands (as proper pairs of course) in the box is not a problem.
The BIGGER issue is the vintage of the gears if you buy on the used market. It's somewhat confusing wihen it comes to plane, M, N or S designated gears. BOTH companies have used those designations for different metalurgical content and machining techniques. At one point I thought I knew the answers to this. But then a new thread started on Apexspeed which seemed to contradict what I thought I knew.
One clue as to what you have. Webster etch's the numbers in to the gear (and usually include a manufacture date). Hewland stamps the numbers on the gears.
If you're interested in more of the saga of gears, here's a good thread to read:
http://www.apexspeed.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16382&highlight=hewland+taylor
Gear Oil:
Used Mobil 1 Synthetic last year and it seemed to work fine. No chips or metalic dust in box or apparent wear on the gears even with a driver TOTALLY new to the Hewland box. But going to Redline Shockproof blue label this year. No particular reason but the Redline seems to be very highly regarded. The good news is, it costs more. Makes you feel like a big time racer when you crack the seal and watch $11 of oil pour out into the bucket and, Andy Armadillo sells it. So we're supporting our local vendor.
The whole Webster/Hewland debate is an on going thing. However, Craig Taylor says the newest generation from both manufacturers are equal.
Price for Websters $195
Price for Hewlands $228
I have yet to hear the definative arguement that confirms one is superior over the other metalurgically (often part of the debate) or in machining (often part of the debate).
How do I choose which to buy? I guess it depends upon my mood on the particular day I order. Sometimes Websters from Pegasus sometimes Hewlands from Averill Racing Stuff. The car purchase Jeff made included a mix and I guess we're keeping that tradition going. Word is, mixing Websters and Hewlands (as proper pairs of course) in the box is not a problem.
The BIGGER issue is the vintage of the gears if you buy on the used market. It's somewhat confusing wihen it comes to plane, M, N or S designated gears. BOTH companies have used those designations for different metalurgical content and machining techniques. At one point I thought I knew the answers to this. But then a new thread started on Apexspeed which seemed to contradict what I thought I knew.
One clue as to what you have. Webster etch's the numbers in to the gear (and usually include a manufacture date). Hewland stamps the numbers on the gears.
If you're interested in more of the saga of gears, here's a good thread to read:
http://www.apexspeed.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16382&highlight=hewland+taylor
Gear Oil:
Used Mobil 1 Synthetic last year and it seemed to work fine. No chips or metalic dust in box or apparent wear on the gears even with a driver TOTALLY new to the Hewland box. But going to Redline Shockproof blue label this year. No particular reason but the Redline seems to be very highly regarded. The good news is, it costs more. Makes you feel like a big time racer when you crack the seal and watch $11 of oil pour out into the bucket
and, Andy Armadillo sells it. So we're supporting our local vendor.
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trout_roberts
Well-known member
Richard
If your talking about the Redline that's sort of turquoise colored, beware!
Talk to Ken Dye before putting it in your gearbox. My recollection is that the chemical compound is similar to brake fluid in that its hydrophilic. It absorbs water. If you leave it in your gearbox for any length of time, it will cause surface corrosion on the steel parts which is virtually everything except the case and the shift forks. If you remove your gearbox at the end of the season and thoroughly flush out the green stuff, you may extend the time before the corrosion begins but you will not eliminate it. The gearbox is vented to atmosphere and the atmosphere in the Pacific Northwest is humid. If you live in Arizona, you'd probably be okay; but not in Seattle.
The Redline MTL or Amsoil's equivalent or even the Valvoline synthetic are good. The advantage that the Shockproof offers is false performance, especially if you're not running at the front of the field.
I used to use a quart of Valvoline gear oil and a cup of Hylton Hyperlube for the molybdenumdisulfide content. Made a nasty looking black concoction but never had a problem with gears, dogs, or bearings.
The best thing I ever did for my gearbox was to have Ken Dye work his magic on it. He, essentially, blueprinted the shift finger portion of the gearbox and the rear cover. It shortened up the shift throws and narrowed up the gate between 1-2 and 3-4. It takes all the vagueness out of the shifting.
If your talking about the Redline that's sort of turquoise colored, beware!
Talk to Ken Dye before putting it in your gearbox. My recollection is that the chemical compound is similar to brake fluid in that its hydrophilic. It absorbs water. If you leave it in your gearbox for any length of time, it will cause surface corrosion on the steel parts which is virtually everything except the case and the shift forks. If you remove your gearbox at the end of the season and thoroughly flush out the green stuff, you may extend the time before the corrosion begins but you will not eliminate it. The gearbox is vented to atmosphere and the atmosphere in the Pacific Northwest is humid. If you live in Arizona, you'd probably be okay; but not in Seattle.
The Redline MTL or Amsoil's equivalent or even the Valvoline synthetic are good. The advantage that the Shockproof offers is false performance, especially if you're not running at the front of the field.
I used to use a quart of Valvoline gear oil and a cup of Hylton Hyperlube for the molybdenumdisulfide content. Made a nasty looking black concoction but never had a problem with gears, dogs, or bearings.
The best thing I ever did for my gearbox was to have Ken Dye work his magic on it. He, essentially, blueprinted the shift finger portion of the gearbox and the rear cover. It shortened up the shift throws and narrowed up the gate between 1-2 and 3-4. It takes all the vagueness out of the shifting.