Race Schedule ?

When is ICSCC going to change the race schedule to more racing and less practice and qualifying. This season SCCBC had a late start to the season so to make up for the lost time we dropped practice & qualifying and combine the two together we had 4 races in two days where you finished in the first race was your grid possion for the second race.
Not sure why you have 2 qualifying sessions not like this is F1 i would rather make every lap count in a race instead of doing laps and burning up tires fuel and equipment. Besides it would also force the guys to have the car ready before race weekend instead of using race weekend to get the car ready.
I would like to have done more ICSCC weekends (Seattle/Portland) but i can't justify the time and expense for one race and i don't want to sit around for three days to have two races.

Alan McColl
03 Tiga CF
 
6 of the 9 ICSCC weekends in 2014 had races every day of the event. 17 of 20 days of events had a race. Actually every day had a race if you count the mini enduro series. The 2015 schedule is not finalized but will be quite similar to 2014.
 
Only 1 race counts for the weekend why not make them all count. SCCBC run 3 times a day is there any any thought to reducing the groups to get more track time i know a number of the open wheel guys from ICSCC that have run with Sovren vintage have said they would to see ICSCC move to a similar schedule.

Alan
 
Hi Alan,
While there are weekends that are single race events or have a non points race associated, there are some weekends that have multiple points races. For example NMS in Spokane hosts a 3 race weekend with all 3 counting for points. Also TC at ORP hosts a weekend with 2 points races and Mission as well in the multiple race category. So in 3 weekends you can have almost all the races necessary for a championship if the number stays the same in 2015 you would only need 2 additional races.
Sherm
 
Hi Sherm
What i would like to see is at least three runs a day i fined that there is to much sitting around between runs. All clubs are having trouble getting more involvement entries so how do we do that to increase or help grow the events. I think we have to get more track time cut back on some classes.
Why is the chump car more attractive to the jounger crowd than our clubs is because it's more exciting lots more track time. Maybe i'm wrong on this but for myself i don't want to travel to events for only two runs a day.
 
Alan,

Since it appears you run a Club Ford, have you thought about entering 2 race groups?

Your car is able to enter Group 3 (CF) and Group 6 (FL) so you can actually get 4 runs per day! Second entry prices are usually about half the normal rate, so you get double the track time for only 50% more in entry fees.
 
If you run 2 race groups you then have 4 qualifying runs that just burning up equipment plus the cost over $500.00 entry fee. SCCBC has 3 runs a day that works really well because the day has been fearly busy with 3 runs. With 2 runs a day it feels like you are out on a picnic with a race car it gets boring and to do 4 runs a day is pushing it financially.
Don't forget as Canadians it's going to cost us an additional 20% because the dollar took a dive great for the US guy's coming to mission reall cheap racing.
Alan
 
If you run 2 race groups you then have 4 qualifying runs that just burning up equipment .....

Lets see, you want to race MORE per weekend but, you don't want to use up your equipment.. I'm now confused. A lot of open wheel guys run Group 3/6. We never did because of the added cost which sounds like the same position you're in.. so be happy and race
 
I don't see the point in burning up the equipment to qualify that many times a day. That's like doing track days.

So, are you thinking... no practice, a qualifier, a race and then a second race starting where you finished the first race, in the same run group, both of which count for points on the same day. And maybe since you traveled, a second day of the same fun and games.

Am I close?

By no means am I trying to be cocky, just trying to help out with clarity. (Actually Im pretty sure this is what your first post said)

For me the Ridge is 14 hrs one way door to door.

Season finale showed me a race isn't a race isn't a race. Huge difference between a Novice race and a Non-points Race, and a big difference between a Non-points race and a points race.

Running the test and tune Friday, the practice sessions Saturday and Sunday felt like track day sessions, but knowing my car had zero issues I worked on vision and smoothness at a comfortable pace not really burning up much of anything.

Always something to learn and strive to perfect (or at least get better at)

I've done a lot of track days to get where I'm at in this adventure. Racing is a privilege, not all get to experience and so much goes into every race weekend (that I don't put into it, thank you to all those that do).

I don't know, a race weekend whether it be practice, qualify or race is time well spent, and I cant wait for the season opener even if it is a 16 hr drive one way for a single points race. Its the total experience, including time between sessions.

Rookie perspective
 
Last edited:
1st: Rules. ICSCC rules dictate the number of championship points races are on the calendar and how many points races a club can host (that's 3 annually). SCCBC hosts 1 triple, NWMS hosts 1 Triple, IRDC and CSCC both host 3 singles while TC hosts 1 double with the option of adding a single or expanding to a triple.

Segundo: So why do those rules in #1 matter? Member clubs and money. Since ICSCC is all about Championship Road Racing this assumes that accruing points and vying for championship is important to the racers, however due to the cost/time of travel the less wealthy racers may have to skip events that are far away. This is bad for their opportunity to accrue points and bad for the clubs hosting the event to meet their budgetary bottom lines. Since the majority of people in the PacNW live in the Puget Sound and Portland Metro areas the IRDC and CSCC events are more readily attended. Thus the double or triple race weekend was born which provided enough incentive (points) and value (multiple races) to make the tow to a far away land like Spokane, ORP or Mission.

Trois: Please consider what ApexDrew points out. You and him have different needs and this racing conference has to appeal to more folks than just seasoned veterans who only want race time. I like more racing and less not-racing but when I was a rookie, I'd take all the track time I could get, racing or otherwise. If you don't want to go out on track to practice, then don't. There is no rule that says you do. I skip practice often and sometimes I use all of qualy, sometimes I just put in 3-4 laps, set my time and come in.

4WD: Consider the format used by IRDC: SQual/Non-Points-Race on SAT and Qual/Race SUN. If you double enter it's Qual-qual-race-race on both days. So no practice and if you don't like Qual, don't do it. But in your first post you mentioned 4 races in 2 days... Well, it exists already, it's right under your nose, go get it. I know for some cars, some drivers or some groups, the non-points race may feel different but for me on 2 separate weekends the Saturday non-points race ended up being the funner of the two. I look forward to seeing you double entered at Pacific and The Ridge next year.
 
Last edited:
Merry Christmas and Happy New Year Brothers and Sisters!

I like the idea of everyone brainstorming and trying different formats to encourage more racing. I think the Saturday non-points races are a blast and the other special races offer more dimension to what Conference is all about.

What I would like us all to consider is the safety factor as we encourage more racing. These new formats have, in many instances, eliminated the Saturday morning practice sessions. By eliminating Saturday morning practice, we are opening ourselves up for a compromise of safety. What I am referring to is the folks that have had their car apart, or installed modifications, need brakes bedded in or tires scrubbed...or even that the driver needs to sharpen up their chops.

By eliminating Saturday morning practice and starting with a go "balls to the wall"* qualifying session, the cars that need shaking down are mixed in with the "serious" qualifiers. Nothing like trying to cut a hot lap and to come up to a slower car at that "can't pass safely zone"...that is sorting somthing out...or, you may be or sorting out whatever or trying to bed in brakes, scrub in new tires and knowing that there are others on the track at the same time that consider you a moving chicane.

Please don't tell me that the Friday test and tunes are for sorting out the cars. Travel distances, work schedules, finances etc. make it so even the most enthusiastic of us cannot take advantage of the Friday sessions.

I'll handle whatever format each host club offers for the race weekend and I race with the intention of keeping my car and me in one piece, but I think that the safety factor in regard to format changes needs some further discussion.

* "balls to the wall - A bit if trivia. It's not the anatomical reference that you may think. Do you know the origin of that term?
 
"balls to the wall - A bit if trivia. It's not the anatomical reference that you may think. Do you know the origin of that term?

Good question. Google says....

First attested in the 1960s in the context of aviation. Probably coined by pilots whose throttle levers had round, ball-like tops and for whom putting the "balls to the wall" (the firewall of the aircraft) meant making the aircraft fly as quickly as possible

Jay Leno says ....
http://youtu.be/zfDYgMfuEvY


...and Flula
http://youtu.be/wva3qypGPvA


Wishing everyone a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year
 
Last edited:
Good question. Google says....

First attested in the 1960s in the context of aviation. Probably coined by pilots whose throttle levers had round, ball-like tops and for whom putting the "balls to the wall" (the firewall of the aircraft) meant making the aircraft fly as quickly as possible
Jay Leno says ....

That is true but, it's origin was during the Second World War when fighter pilots used to put the "balls to the wall" to chase German fighters over Britain.

Source of info. an aging P-51 fighter pilot.
 
Last edited:
Yup...Drew and Richard got it right! Thanks guys!

Now that we answered that question. Any ideas about the safety factor related to having or not having the Saturday morning practice?
 
Alan, this discussion has been ongoing for many, many years. After pushing the multiple race agenda, we finally made gains by clubs like NWMS and TC hosting double or triple events. Next is the chore of getting more racing and less qualifying. The Saturday qualifying is called a race, but without points it means little to most drivers, but it is a start, and a good one.
Sovren does a quick practice/qual on Saturday during their 2 day events, and then offers at least 4 or 5 races thereafter. Most are 15 or 20 minutes, which at my, (our) age is a blessing in 100 degree heat! We have proposed these changes frequently exactly because there is too much standing around between sessions. I personally would prefer 3 or 4 20 minutes sessions to one 20 and one 30. It would liven up the week-end for the workers and our HUGE fan base as well!
 
Wes, thats why i ran vintage for so many years we had 4 20min runs a day it was great. The problem is there are way to many folk that feel they have to object to change because thats the way it's always been they not even sure why they are objecting it just seems to be the right thing to do. Kinda the same thing that happened to the big three who thought they could keep selling the same old thing before they knew it the world passed them by. People are going to go where they get the best bang for the buck. I still have no idea why you there is 2 qualifying's for one race this isn't F1.
Anyway Merry Christmas to all hope you have a great day.
 
A thought for the non-races that seem to count

Since we will now have Saturday races that aren't races until the stewards say afterward that they are, can we use a few race techniques in them? We all know that "Racing by Braille" is strictly forbidden during qualifying, which the Saturday afternoon track session now isn't, then can we use a few "Racing Incident" techniques that may have the down-stream advantage of making a competitor's car less competitive, or even absent, for the Sunday points race?

Further. This elimination of non-racing sessions is all well and good until it bites one of its proponents. Years ago I know of someone who through other FUBAB's made only the Saturday qualifying and the Sunday race. A reasonable example of what we now propose. The car failed during the race by a simple loose wire or cotter pin falling out that an addition track session would have chased out. Let's try at least one weekend where there is no "wasted" track time, just roll off the trailers, through tech. and out onto the track for the points race. I have faith in my car to try it, how many others do the same?

- - - Updated - - -

Since we will now have Saturday races that aren't races until the stewards say afterward that they are, can we use a few race techniques in them? We all know that "Racing by Braille" is strictly forbidden during qualifying, which the Saturday afternoon track session now isn't, then can we use a few "Racing Incident" techniques that may have the down-stream advantage of making a competitor's car less competitive, or even absent, for the Sunday points race?

Further. This elimination of non-racing sessions is all well and good until it bites one of its proponents. Years ago I know of someone who through other FUBAB's made only the Saturday qualifying and the Sunday race. A reasonable example of what we now propose. The car failed during the race by a simple loose wire or cotter pin falling out that an addition track session would have chased out. Let's try at least one weekend where there is no "wasted" track time, just roll off the trailers, through tech. and out onto the track for the points race. I have faith in my car to try it, how many others do the same?
 
Back
Top